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Applesnail.net • View topic - Nerite success! (finally!)

Nerite success! (finally!)

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Nerite success! (finally!)

Postby Donya on Sun Jul 02, 2006 6:44 am

Almost a year later, and after fine-tuning my saltwater system...I have baby Nerites. I'm not sure yet whether they are Neritina virginea or reclivata, but they are definitely Nerites. I've had eggs being laid and hatching almost continuously since the spring, but finally found a couple pinhead-sized babies today. The larval forms must have finally had enough food in the water and good water conditions to turn into little snails and grow to a visible size. I've got my fingers and toes crossed that they have enough microalgae to eat in the tank to survive to a larger size so I can at least determine the species. Tank stats have been:

- sg: 1.023
- temperature: 78-82
- pH: 8.3
- kH: ~12
- Kent's liquid calcium 1 drop/gallon per day. No calcium kit, but had it tested at a store and the overal level was "high" even for reef environments
- iodine supliment
- topoff with R/O water daily
- water changes once in a blue moon, only 10% or less


I suspect, based on breeding activity, that it is the Neritina virginea that have had babies. Both have been breeding, but the virginea have been the most active the past few months. But, I won't know for certain until I get a baby big enough to show shell coloration.
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Postby badflash on Sun Jul 02, 2006 2:54 pm

Wow! Give me more!
How long does it take to acclimate them to salt water?
What food are you giving them? What sort of feeding schedule? Water changes etc.

Very cool!
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Postby plecoperson on Sun Jul 02, 2006 4:02 pm

Congratulations-it sounds like they have a complex reproduction/maturation cycle; what a feat. Yay!
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Postby SnailTrail on Sun Jul 02, 2006 6:04 pm

Congrats.:hey:

I can't wait to see pics of baby nerites.
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Postby morphriz on Sun Jul 02, 2006 7:09 pm

Congratulations!

Great that you got it to work! I wonder if you would consider making more acurate tests on your water. The ones I'd like to know is calcium, magnesium and maybe silica. The latter might be important for the snails as well.
cheers
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Postby Aquaria on Sun Jul 02, 2006 7:19 pm

Oh Donya I'm envious! Congrats and good job :D
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Postby Donya on Sun Jul 02, 2006 8:38 pm

Forgot to add a non-Nerite livestock list (this is important--it's what keeps the setup functional):
- 1 Margarites, eats tougher algaes
- 2 Strombus luhuanus, effectively detritivores
- 2 Strombus gigas babies (<1"), also effectively detritivores
- 1 Gobiodon okinawae yellow clown goby, the key to the tank's success, since it fuels algal growth
- Dense "forest" of Caulerpa macro algae that is home to zillions of small crustaceans
- 1 Corallimorph...this is a strange one. I didn't add it, and it was far too long in showing up to have come in on the live rock. My guess is that it came in as a larae in some LFS water.


Wow! Give me more!
How long does it take to acclimate them to salt water?
What food are you giving them? What sort of feeding schedule? Water changes etc.


For N. reclivata it was more than a month to acclimate, and it was done because they wouldn't stay in the water for very long until I had the sg up to about 1.010. Then they wouldn't eat much until I had it to around 1.018. The sg range they like is 1.021-1.025, which as been the same for N. virginea--although those I purchased from the saltwater section of the LFS after my tank was over 1.021. Based on the price and supplier, it is fairly likely that the virginea were wild-caught in saltwater.

Food is pretty basic...just a piece of dried seaweed/macro algae (alternating a couple types) each day and a spirulina pellet or two occasionally--although those are mainly for the conches. The rest of the Nerites' diet is grown in the tank on the rocks and tank walls.

Water changes are minimal. Every month or so I take 5-10% of the water out so I can use it to scrub down the powerhead intake sponge. It's only a 5 gallon tank, so that basically amounts to a few cups of water out and in. I try to avoid taking out excessive amounts of water because I know there are veliger larvae present.

I wonder if you would consider making more acurate tests on your water. The ones I'd like to know is calcium, magnesium and maybe silica.


I may be getting a calcium test kit soon, but magnesium and silica will be difficult. I havn't seen a silica test kit anywhere locally, and the good magnesium kits (and calcium kits for that matter) are extreemly expensive per-test. The LFS will only test magnesium if the pH is off in the water sample, and will not test silica. If I'm able to get accurate reports for magnesium and/or silica I will be sure to post them.
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Postby morphriz on Tue Jul 04, 2006 9:37 am

Donya wrote:Forgot to add a non-Nerite livestock list (this is important--it's what keeps the setup functional):
- 1 Margarites, eats tougher algaes
- 2 Strombus luhuanus, effectively detritivores
- 2 Strombus gigas babies (<1"), also effectively detritivores
- 1 Gobiodon okinawae yellow clown goby, the key to the tank's success, since it fuels algal growth
- Dense "forest" of Caulerpa macro algae that is home to zillions of small crustaceans
- 1 Corallimorph...this is a strange one. I didn't add it, and it was far too long in showing up to have come in on the live rock. My guess is that it came in as a larae in some LFS water.

What equipment have you got in the tank? Substrate?

Donya wrote:
I wonder if you would consider making more acurate tests on your water. The ones I'd like to know is calcium, magnesium and maybe silica.


I may be getting a calcium test kit soon, but magnesium and silica will be difficult. I havn't seen a silica test kit anywhere locally, and the good magnesium kits (and calcium kits for that matter) are extreemly expensive per-test. The LFS will only test magnesium if the pH is off in the water sample, and will not test silica. If I'm able to get accurate reports for magnesium and/or silica I will be sure to post them.


Tropic-Marine have a combined Ca/Mg test thats about 30% or so off on buying both the Ca and Mg. Since you are using a comercial additive it's impossible to predict what your values might be. Does the Kent additive you used have a contents declaration? Your alk is abit high but as long as Ca stays up that's not an issue. I cant see that such values are imperative for breeding though since that's not "natural". You seems to have achieved an environment very rich in algae and tiny critters so I'm guessing that bioactivity and algae diversity is more important.

Anyways you've done a great job. I'd really like to reproduce your setup. I just have to get approval in the local(my apartment) goverment. :)

Happy snailing :snail:
//Mattias
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Postby Donya on Tue Jul 04, 2006 8:16 pm

What equipment have you got in the tank? Substrate?


There is an aquatic gardens powerhead that gives 40x turnover. There is a thick sponge over the intake. I have a homemade protein skimmer on it too, but I don't use it much anymore in the interest of not skimming out larvae. There is also a heater in there, but again not used unless room temperature calls for it. The substrate is about 2-3cm of crushed coral with about 3-4lbs of live rock (can't remember how much exactly).

I cant see that such values are imperative for breeding though since that's not "natural". You seems to have achieved an environment very rich in algae and tiny critters so I'm guessing that bioactivity and algae diversity is more important.


I agree, the microalgae is probably the key to the survival of the baby snails. The high amounts of calcium and high kH have primarily helped to stop shell erosion on the adults and allow them to produce thick new shell growth. Nerites in captivity (especially N. reclivata) seem prone to shell erosion.

This is a recent picture of the tank:

Image
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Postby lucky on Sat Nov 11, 2006 4:03 pm

Hi,

how are your baby Neritinas? Do you have some pics of them, with their growing progress? I'm so curious!!! :D Please give us an update.
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Convergence of though

Postby morphriz on Sat Nov 11, 2006 4:58 pm

I was just about to ask the same thing. Though of it when I found a dead nerite in one of my FW tanks. I the span of 1 hour we think/do the same thing.... Interesting world...
cheers Mattias
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Postby badflash on Sat Mar 03, 2007 3:19 pm

Donya,
Can you provide an update? There is a fellow in another forum that does not believe that you've done this, even though I showed him this thread. You seem to have a tiny bit of spare time lately, so if you could just give us a few words it would be appreciated.
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Postby Leonard on Sun Mar 04, 2007 2:30 pm

Hi!

I hope you can forgive me about my bad english, but I'll try the best I can! :) I've lust bought my very first snails, so I'm quite a newbie on this! Sry if I ask something stupid :oops:

Now I have Neritina natalensis (I think it's natalensis, but I'm not really sure) in a 102l tank. Together with some Tanganyika chichlids. Now the levels of the water is like this: pH 8.0 KH 11. I have no salt in yhe water, and right now the snails are there for only ine reason: eating alges.
I thuoght I maybee would start a 10-20l tank, to trying to grow this kind of snail.

I don't know anything about the salt level in the water, but do Neritna really need salt in their to have babies? Do anyone have some site with information about salt levels, and so on, so that I can learn?

Does Ca matters much? What is this Kent-? thing that a lots of you talk about? Where do you buy it?

What do I need and how shall I do to have everything for to start a 10-20l tank and try to breed Neritina?


And an other thin: I thougt they only were eating alges, how do you do to dry microalges (where do you get them?), can you feed them with anything else? what?
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Postby morphriz on Thu Mar 08, 2007 12:47 pm

Tjena Leonard..

The Neritidae snails often breed in brakish to full salt environments. To breed the snails you will need a commercial saltmix to mix real saltwater, if you do 10% weekly waterchanges for your snails with any decent saltmix that should probably take care of their Ca(Calcium) needs. You will also need something to measure salinity with, since the snails live in bracish conditions I dont think you need a real good salinitymeter. The plastic swing-arm model will work fine. Some liverock will probably bee good to get some algae cultures going.

Since you live in Kungsbacka you shouldn't have any problem getting hold of this stuff. I'm not 100% sure if there is a marine fish store in Kungsbacka but I thing there is(never been there, only heard of it). If not there are several good ones in and aroung Gothenburg.(Marinakvariet i Mölndal, Ciklidleken i Lerum mfl)

I do recommend that you check out some marine forums about keeping marine tanks. Marine tanks like these small snailtanks are not as expensive and timeconsuming as reeftanks(aquariums with coral reefs) but they still require some basic knowledge about seawater and it's chemistry.
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Postby badflash on Thu Mar 08, 2007 4:15 pm

Breeding these snails is not a beginners project. While several people like Donya have published that they have had success (and she is a pretty advanced snail keeper), virtually no one else has duplicated their results.

Until the a mothodolgy is published that can be duplicated by others, breeding these snails in captivity is an art, not a science.

My experience in keeping these is that they will lay eggs in fresh water, but not in salt. I have a fair number of olive nerites that I've kept in a variety of slat levels from brackish to full marine and in salt water I get no eggs. I even took some eggs from fresh water and moved them to salt, but got no hatches.

My personal belief is that they breed in tidal river areas where the salt changes from pure fresh to pure salt twice a day. That would be a tough thing to set up in an aquarium.
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